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Location: Pretoria, South Africa | Hi, everyone. I've been "lurking" around here for several months, and it's a lot of fun to read all the friendly "abuse" and banter flying around here.
I've been an Ovation fan since 1987, when I bought a Celebrity CC01 (I think). Been playing it all this time, until I got a Balladeer LX in August. I was seriously impressed with the upgrade!
However! I recently started noticing some extraordinary fret wear on the LX, and I've only been playing it for less than 3 months! I probably play no more than 1 hour per day in total, and I never saw fret wear on my Celebrity in 10 years.
How long are frets supposed to last? 10 years sounds about right for my playing frequency? I've only changed strings once, to D'Addario Extra Lights, so the only strings that the guitar has had on are the Lights that were fitted at the factory and the EL set that's on there now. Is it possible that a "bad batch" of fret wire was used on my LX?
At the rate the frets are going, I may have to replace them before the end of the year! I imagine they are covered under the Ovation warranty?
I really hope you guys can give me some advice! Thanks. |
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Posts: 1225
Location: Lake Hiawatha, New Jersey | I would contact customer service right away. There should not be any noticable fret wear on a 3 month old guitar no matter how much you're playing it. I have a legend LX that is about 6 months old and has no sign of fret wear, and I play the guitar nearly every day for at least an hour and have played several 3 - 4 hour gigs with it.
I have a Martin that's pushing ten years old and there is some fret wear on that one, but it's not causing any problems, so I'm leaving it alone for now. A friend of mine has a 30 year old Martin that has only needed a fret job once.
Did you inspect the frets when you bought the guitar? Is it possible that someone screwed around with the frets before you bought it? Just a thought. Good luck. |
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Posts: 6
Location: Pretoria, South Africa | John, I'm pretty sure the frets were brand new. I think I would have noticed the wear if it was that bad when I got the guitar. But the more scary reason is that it's been getting worse since I noticed it! I'll try and get a good photo and post it.
Would you know about warranty coverage on this? |
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Posts: 14127
Location: 6 String Ranch | Fretware is from how often you play, they types of frets you have, the kind of strings you use and your personal body chemistry. Maybe one of those has changed? Maybe there are a different alloy fret on the aLeX model? |
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Location: Charlotte NC | My 1771 LX is 7 months old, I play about an hour a day, and 2-3 hrs on weekends. It's as good as new. |
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Location: NJ | Do you play a lot with a capo?
If so, what kind?
Does it fit properly? |
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Posts: 6
Location: Pretoria, South Africa | "Fretware" ... now THERE's a new marketing term! Kind of in the vein of "hardware", "software", etc. Sorry, W-2, I know by now that spelling is not one of your priorities. :-)
How often I play has not changed. I can't answer for the type of alloy used in the LX frets. Certainly my body chemistry hasn't changed (how would you do that??? :-), and I've been using D'Addario strings for a decade. So no variables other than the guitar have changed.
I don't play with a capo AT ALL. I have one in my case, but it sorta feels like cheating ... :-)
My theory is that there is something wrong with the frets fitted to my LX. I don't know if this is possible.
Any word on whether these are included in the warranty? Surely wear at this rate HAS to be covered?
Thanks for all the input so far! |
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Location: Lake Hiawatha, New Jersey | Is the problem on one particular fret or is it on several frets? If one or two of the frets were slightly higher than the rest, that could cause them to wear out faster. If that were the case, the frets can be easily leveled. I would contact customer service and ask them. Ovation's customer service people are very good. If there is a defect in the guitar, I'm sure that they will fix it. |
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Posts: 14842
Location: NJ | ". . . my body chemistry hasn't changed (how would you do that??? :-) . . ."
Come up and spend a weekend with me . . .
. . . I've managed to make a career of it . . |
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Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | [QUOTE Certainly my body chemistry hasn't changed (how would you do that??? :-), [/QB]
You really don't want me to get into that do you? |
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Location: NJ | Al;
With THIS kind of "timing",
you and I should put a band together!
LOL!! |
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Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | Izak,
Unless you took a file or a hammer to it, I don't think it is anything you did. Contact the seller.
My bit of reckless speculation is that some fret material missed the heat treat process that hardens it up. |
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Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | Originally posted by cliff:
Al;
With THIS kind of "timing",
you and I should put a band together!
LOL!!
I am available |
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Posts: 14842
Location: NJ | Yeah, but that guitar you've got is . . .
. . . . just "wrong"!!! :D |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | Fretware, did someone say fretware?
www.fretware.com |
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March 2004
Posts: 201
Location: Vernon, CT | I have a new Balladeer LX and Legend LX. I've been playing them for several months and there is no sign of fret ware(great guitars). Forget the stuff about bio-crap and all the other silly stuff. Take it to the dealer and/or contact the Big O factory period. Something is wrong, it is a new guitar and under warranty. Play On!
John L.
Custom Legend 1779-USA
Legend LX 1777-LX
Balladeer 1771-LX
Std. Balladeer 1771
Tornado (1970)
Takamine 12 String
Martin D16GT
Fender Tele-
Fender Strat-
Fender P-Bass (1975) |
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Posts: 648
Location: Florida | just gonna add....
Lack of cleanliness contributes to fretwear. Cleaning under the strings helps (it does!), as do clean hands. Any grit or grime on your fingers will help abrade the frets.
Ditto... if you "polish" those frets... be sure to really clean them well so you're not getting abrasive wear from that source too. |
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Posts: 627
Location: Cherry Hill, NJ | Fretware, by that you mean slight depressions in the frets where the strings come in to contact with the frets. This should not happen with a guitar less than a year old or older. I can't imagine that happening, as Ovations (USA) use top quality materials. Contact Ovation.
I have a Vintage LX (Feb 2004) that I play everyday, no fretware here.
Tommy |
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Posts: 1380
Location: Central Oregon | Originally posted by BruDev:
Fretware, did someone say fretware?
www.fretware.com
Thanks for the link. I just ordered a set of dots from them. For $12.50 I'll give 'em a shot. If I don't like 'em I'll take 'em back off.
/\/\/ |
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Location: San Bernardino, California | I suscept that you'll need to clean the fretboard thoroughly before applying them. |
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Posts: 1380
Location: Central Oregon | I got the dots today & put some on the 2002 tonight. I was wrong about when I ordered them, it was the 17th of last month, not the 3rd. The pix don't really do them justice, they actually look pretty damned nice! Easy to apply & they stick like nobodies business. You can still get 'em off if you want to though. I got one a tad off center & used the tip of my little pointy Case knife to pop it loose & move it. Didn't seem to hurt it any & it stuck back down fine. I can't feel 'em when I'm playing & you have to look REALLY close to tell they aren't inlaid. If I push the strings out of the way I can feel the edges with my fingertips but I can't feel them when I'm playing. All that remains to be seen is if they'll stay put. From what I've seen so far I think they will.
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Posts: 6
Location: Pretoria, South Africa | Guys, I'd like to get back to the topic, if you don't mind. :-)
I have now contacted Ovation support, who have very politely told me that they are "sorry" about the problems with my guitar, but I'd have to send it for an "evaluation" before they can decide to repair it. Isn't this a bit funny? I need some assurance that it will be repaired before I arrange to ship the guitar to the States.
I've also contacted my dealer (bought over the Internet), and they are waiting for Ovation support to get back to them.
From what I've been reading on OFC, Ovation's support is great, but that's not my experience so far ... I've been waiting for almost a month since first contacting Ovation, and no resolution has been forthcoming.
I've even sent Ovation photos of the worn frets, but it hasn't made a difference.
Can anybody here refer me to someone in Ovation that I can discuss this with? |
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Posts: 234
Location: Phoenix, AZ | Izak, I'm somewhat confused. Do you expect the Factory to tell you they'll give you another guitar or replace your frets without seeing your guitar? Doesn't anyone want to see a problem before committing to fix it? Now, the Ovation Factory has a long history of standing behind their products. You can either trust them to get you a guitar that meets all of their specifications or you can not trust them. If you trust them, you'll follow the lead of many who have relied on this trust, and been rewarded. If you don't trust the Factory, I don't know what anyone in the OFC can do for you.
A search of the Ovation web site shows one dealer in South Africa. If you bought your guitar from this dealer, they should help you. If you didn't buy from this dealer, then your recourse is with the Factory in the U.S. |
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Posts: 648
Location: Florida | Be assured Ovation will fix the problem. Fixed under warranty or not... well thats to be decided, but it will be fixed.
I'd REALLY love to see some pictures of the wear, and perhaps you can get some to Ovation via email as well? |
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Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | I'm interested to see how this turns out. Excessively worn frets on a brand new guitar is just an odd combination. I hope the place Izak bought it will do the right thing, even if they are not a direct dealer. But...something is odd. |
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Location: Pretoria, South Africa | Dmkozak, sorry for the confusion :-) The factory has "seen" the frets in a way, as I've given them photographs which quite clearly show the problem. I don't know what else there is to see, but I'm obviously not an Ovation technician. I guess my argument is that the only way the frets could have worn so fast (we're talking 3 months of light playing!) is if I used a file to grind them down. Now, I PROMISE I did not do that :-) There is obviously something seriously wrong with this specific guitar (Kaman says they have not had this issue with ANY other LX or other O guitars).
As mentioned earlier, I'm not doing anything weird with this guitar, and it's taking much less of a beating than my previous guitar, a Celebrity, which I had for 17 years before changing the frets.
The second issue I have is that the cost to ship it to the States (I did not buy from the local SA dealer) will be almost a third (!) of the price of the guitar. For me to pay that much and then find out the factory will not repair it, is too great a risk at this point. If this happens, I could just as well have bought an Elite LX, which probably would have had good frets! (If only I'd known! :-)
CharlieB, I'll try and post pictures of the frets, but Ovation have already seen the pictures. Their only response was "send the guitar for evaluation." Also they said a bad batch of fret material would have shown up in more guitars, which I agree with.
SlipKid, I agree 100% with you. Something is very odd.
If I could just get some kind of assurance that the guitar WILL be repaired/replaced, I'd feel a lot better to ship it. |
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Posts: 6
Location: Pretoria, South Africa | On posting pictures of the frets, it looks like you need to put the pics somewhere on the web and link to them. I thought I could upload them directly to the board from my local drive. Anyhow, I don't have access to a web server where I can put the pics, so for now I'll e-mail them to anyone who's interested.
CharlieB, I'll mail you the pictures, as you've already asked. |
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Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | This is starting to remind me of another warrenty issue covered on this board. That thread seemed to on for a "lifetime". |
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Posts: 234
Location: Phoenix, AZ | Originally posted by Izak:
Dmkozak, sorry for the confusion :-) The factory has "seen" the frets in a way, as I've given them photographs which quite clearly show the problem. I don't know what else there is to see, ......
The second issue I have is that the cost to ship it to the States (I did not buy from the local SA dealer) will be almost a third (!) of the price of the guitar. For me to pay that much and then find out the factory will not repair it, is too great a risk at this point. If this happens, I could just as well have bought an Elite LX, which probably would have had good frets! (If only I'd known! :-) ...
First, the Factory has not seen the guitar, they've only seen pictures of the frets. There's a difference, a very big difference, between a picture and the actual subject of the picture.
Second, it sounds like this is your biggest concern, the cost to return the guitar to the Factory. If the Factory were right down the street from you, and you could walk it over, you probably wouldn't mind the Factory wanting to see the actual guitar.
That you've been asked to return the guitar to the Factory is based solely on your not buying the guitar from your country's sole authorized retailer of Ovations. The Factory has a distribution chain which assures the Factory their guitars will be properly handled until put in the customer's hands. While you may not have done anything to affect this guitar's frets, the Factory doesn't know if someone outside their chain of distribution did something to this guitar before you purchased it. That's why your seller may be the person most responsible for this guitar.
The Factory, apparently, saw enough in your pictures, to ask you to send the guitar in for actual inspection. Since the cost of doing so (without any guarantee of what they'll do) appears to be your biggest problem, maybe you could ask the Factory is there's someplace closer to you, and less costly for you, where you could ship the guitar for inspection and repair/replacement.
Please remember, the Factory does not (and virtually no manufacturers of any product that I'm aware of) pay for return shipping to look at problems. The Factory appears willing to help you, IF you'll return the guitar to them for their inspection. Had the guitar been purchased through the Factory's normal chain of distribution, you might not have to pay to return it all the way to the Factory, However, since it was not purchased through the Factory's normal chain of distribution, the buyer assumes these risks when purchasing outside the Factory's normal chain of distribution. The Factory appears willing to stand behind it's product and it's guarantee, (after all, the Factory isn't telling you it won't help you), but, because of how and where the guitar was purchased, the buyer will have to return the guitar to the Factory if the buyer wants the Factory's help and assistance.
If you look at this from the Factory's standpoint, you'll see they're trying to help you, but you're not giving them the chance. |
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Location: SoCal | Izak:
This thread pops up every once in a while and drives everybody crazy in that there is only so much that can be said about it before it the arguments start repeating over and over.
I have no doubt that you've got a legitimate problem and feel like the factory should do something for you. Let me see if I understand it correctly.
I bought a brand new Porsche but didn't buy it from a dealer. After just a few months, the engine is running roughly and it's obvious that something is wrong. I want to send it to the factory to have it fixed (I certainly shouldn't have to pay for it locally as it is a brand new car) and the factory has said that I need to send it to them so they can evaluate it. But the cost of sending it to Germany would be almost a third the cost of the actual car, and Porsche has not assured me that they will repair or replace the car under warranty before I send it. Isn't Porsche being unfair?
No.
Look, you've got three options that I see. First, sell the guitar and buy another. Second, have it refreted locally. Third, bite the bullet, send the guitar to Ovation and let them make a decision. I can tell you from experience that Ovation customer service is the best in the business and if you're nice to them, they will bend over backwards to make things right.
But keep in mind a couple of things. First, you made the decision to buy outside the system. That puts the responsibility for repairs or problems on you, not them. If you had purchased the guitar from an authorized dealer, then all you would have had to do was go back there with your guitar and Ovation would have been happy to make things right, probably at no cost to you. But you made the original decsion as to where to purchase the guitar. Second, people at Ovation read this board. If you complain about them (read that as "if you whine about how unfair they are") do you really think they'll bend over backwards to help you?
You've got the answers to your questions. Everybody here will be interested in what you decide and hope that you get the problem resolved. But don't keep harping on this. Your next post should be to tell us what you are going to do.
End of discussion. Click. |
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Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | ok you bought it over the internet. was it from a dealer in the states? if so, then you saved a TON of cash by buying it via the states and you should have known that you are taking some of the risk into your own hands by making that purchase that is not local.
You have only given us pieces of the facts and not the whole story. Sometimes when you gamble to save money you lose. Follow protocol and I am sure you guitar will get repaired if you have a legitimate complaint. |
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Serious fret wear on 3-month old 1771LX