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Posts: 1634
Location: Warren,Pa. | I actually have one: a '97 C. I also have a '76 Folklore. What I REALLY want is the skinny 12 fret slothead neck like my '97C has...on a full-size body that has a huge sound. Like the Folklore.
Does such a thing exist? I know 12 fret slotheads are usually fingerstyle guitars, but a 1-11/16 nut is a lot easier on my hand.
Thanks : ) John. |
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Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Look for a non ovation parlor guitar |
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Posts: 766
Location: New Hampsha | Send your parlor to Mother and you can have your parlor neck put on whatever your heart desires.
Only money... |
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Posts: 5881
Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | I'm sure you could have one built. Call Al. |
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Posts: 14127
Location: 6 String Ranch | the 97 was the only one made that way.
It was quite looked down upon. |
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Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | get a Hurricane (Storm series) and plug in... |
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Posts: 2683
Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | I'm just wondering why you want a 12-fretter. When Trader Jim and Iffy compared their two parlors, one a 12 fret slot-head, and the other a 14 fret paddle-head, the 14 fretter sounded better. That one is in my stable for the time being and it DOES sound good. I think that the supposed tone difference between 12 and 14 fretters is either a myth, or negligable. Same thing with slot-heads. I mean, every guitar of the same model sounds a little bit different from each other anyway. How could you really tell unless you changed the neck on the same guitar body? I have found that with a 12 fretter, not only do I run out of room sometimes, but I also overshoot sometimes when I'm jumping up to a bar. And the slotheads are a pain to change strings on. I know, I know, if you do it the right way everything turns out OK, but paddle heads are still quicker and easier. |
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Posts: 12759
Location: Boise, Idaho | John, have you tried a Ute or LAV Koa? I have a 77 Folklore and love the sound. It's very different sounding from the Ute or LAV, but the necks on the latter 2 seem significantly smaller than the Folklore. I know those guitars don't meet your desire of a Folklore sound with a slothead skinny neck, but you might like the sound and neck on one of those. I also know we're all drawing blanks, but I was trying to come up with a compromise instead of just a "nope". |
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Posts: 1634
Location: Warren,Pa. | Thank you for your thoughts everyone. I was afraid there would be no easy answer.
Alison- I have 3 Ovations now...all 12 fret slotheads. I like my left hand being 2-3 inches closer to me. It's comfortable. I like a slothead simply because I think it makes for a beautiful headstock.
I know most people here favor a wider neck, but arthritis is getting the better of my left hand, and the narrower neck makes all the difference for me.
Maybe I need to take my Folklore with it's 1-7/8" nut and shave 3/32" off each side.
John <>{ |
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March 2008
Posts: 2683
Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | Well that explains it. If you're used to a 12 fretter, you would UNDERshoot on those bars with a 14 fretter. I understand the narrower neck. It's what I've always played so I like it, and MY arthritis has been pesky lately too. Looks like you're only going to get one by placing a custom order though. It's too bad, but it just might be worth it. Best of luck to you. |
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Posts: 4233
Location: Steeler Nation, Hudson Valley Contingent | Find a folklore with a damaged neck for cheap on eBay or Craigs List. (A pacemaker can work too, but you would have to replace the bridge as well.) Send it to the factory for repairs.
In fact, see if this guy is willing to come down a little.
Pacemaker that didn\'t sell
You can figure out the rest for yourself. ;) :cool: |
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December 2003
Posts: 13996
Location: Upper Left USA | John,
I think I might have enough parts if you want to work with me. I just put together a 1113 neck at 2" with a cutaway body and an iDea preamp. It's as confused as they get but if the player is happy... |
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February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by CanterburyStrings:
I'm just wondering why you want a 12-fretter. When Trader Jim and Iffy compared their two parlors, one a 12 fret slot-head, and the other a 14 fret paddle-head, the 14 fretter sounded better. That one is in my stable for the time being and it DOES sound good. I think that the supposed tone difference between 12 and 14 fretters is either a myth, or negligable. First you say the opinions of two other people (not yourself, mind you, but you state their opinions in such a way that it appears they support your theory) is that the 14 fretter sounds better.
Then you state that you believe there is no difference between them (or 'myth' as you say).
You can't have it both ways.
Of course there's a difference in tone. You can't very well move the bridge 2 inches deeper into the lower bout and not produce a 'different' tone. The real issue is whether or not you 'like' one better than the other, and that's a very subjective and personal preference.
As far as the slothead is concerned, most I've played have a sharper break angle over the nut, and that's also going to effect the tone, though to a lesser degree.
Like John, I also find the 12 fretters more comfortable to play. Since my LAVKoa is a cutaway, it doesn't hinder my ability to go to the 12th fret.
I don't understand the 'overshoot' and undershoot' comments at all. Perhaps I've been playing guitar too long to get it. |
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Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | The last couple of guitars I have ordered (Collings & Borges) had "short scale" necks which I supposed in some ways would equate to a 12 fretter.
Much more comfortable to play with the looser string tension and I have never had problems overshooting or undershooting my position on the fretboard. Course I tend to peek.... |
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Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Ditto T28 on short scale. I recent aquired a jumbo with a short scale (sorta like a girl with a fat ass and a flat chest) and the playing comfort is oooh sooo gooood. Ironically one of my other favorite guitars for several years now has been a certain OM and I couldn't put my finger on why it was so nice to play. Turns out that it's a short scale, and I didn't even know it.
As for 12 fret vs. 14 fret, there absolutely IS a difference in sound and it's just a matter of which you prefer. I owned a Folkmore LX 12 fret and 14 fret at the same time and the 14 sounds like shite compared to the 12. But currently I own the Lost Art Koa 12 and 14 fret guitars and I would have to say I prefer the sound of the 14. But it's all a matter of what YOUR ears hear, there is no hard and fast rule. |
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Posts: 5881
Location: Colorado Rocky Mountains | Fender's Jaguar is considered a short scale at 24.5" between nut and bridge. The feel is definitely very different from a typical 25.5" scale model. I haven't measured a Storm, but those things are also wickedly short on a hanger compared to, say, a Gretsch or Gibson archtop. Anybody know the scale of a Storm series model offhand? |
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Location: closely held secret | The short scale Rickenbacker's at NAMM were a lot of fun. Might have to put one of those on my list. |
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Location: Tennessee | The short scale Rics are REAL short scale. The 325 is 20.75". |
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Location: closely held secret | Yup. REAL fun! |
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Posts: 12759
Location: Boise, Idaho | Originally posted by Gallerinski:
I recent aquired a jumbo with a short scale (sorta like a girl with a fat ass and a flat chest) and the playing comfort is oooh sooo gooood. it's just a matter of which you prefer. So did you sign a pact with Jeff and Cliff that they won't pounce on you when you make statements like this, or is this such an easy lob that it's beneath them? |
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December 2006
Posts: 6268
Location: Florida Central Gulf Coast | Originally posted by ProfessorBB:
Anybody know the scale of a Storm series model offhand? My Tornado is 24.5".
If anyone is interested in the '97C vs. 5741 parlor review, HERE"S the post.
BTW, I listened to and played three UTEs at SJII and each one sounded different, although one did stand out. I guess it's all in the ears, guitar, strings, etc... |
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Posts: 2683
Location: Hot Springs, S.D. | Waskel, I could say "do a search", but I think it was on the thread where TJ was selling the 14 fretter. Both TJ and Iffy said that the 14 fretter sounded better. That's one of the reasons I bought it. Dave just said that his 14 fret Koa sounds better than the 12 fretter. Yeah, it's all in the persons ear, but what I'm getting at is, it could be the wood on the top, or how much glue they used. Look at how I got in two 2077LX's at the same time - IDENTICAL guitars, and one of them sounded (to my ears and the rest of the gang here at the shop) SO much better. I just think there are too many variables to decide that one scale length sounds better than another.
As far as overshooting, yeah, maybe I should look at what I'm doing, but with the 12 fretter, my hand and elbow are not in the same position as when I play my other guitars. I have found many times that when I go up to where the seventh fret normally is on a 14 fretter, I end up on the eighth or ninth instead. |
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Posts: 8307
Location: Tennessee | Originally posted by 2ifbyC:
BTW, I listened to and played three UTEs at SJII and each one sounded different, although one did stand out. I guess it's all in the ears, guitar, strings, etc... ... and especially the player, from where the tone really emanates. No offense to anyone who may have been playing them. |
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May 2008
Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Newsflash ... There is a reason that there are 12 fret and 14 fret guitars; skinny neck and wide neck; slotheads and flatheads; etc. Everyone has different personal preferences. It's not true that every wide neck is easier to play, and that every 12 fretter sounds beter, and that every slothead is difficult to string. It's all just personal preference and opinion.
You should try a Takamine EF417S |
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April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | oh yeah....the EF417S....sweeeeeeet playing and sounding guitar.
I'm still kinda pissed at myself for letting that one go but at the time I was having a serious love affair with a couple of C-10s (still am for that matter but I could definitely justify a Ménage à trois with that one back in the mix). |
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Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | Originally posted by CanterburyStrings:
Waskel, I could say "do a search", but I think it was on the thread where TJ was selling the 14 fretter. Both TJ and Iffy said that the 14 fretter sounded better. I don't need to do a search. I don't really care.
Originally posted by CanterburyStrings:
Dave just said that his 14 fret Koa sounds better than the 12 fretter. No, he didn't.
Originally posted by Gallerinski:
I own the Lost Art Koa 12 and 14 fret guitars and I would have to say I prefer the sound of the 14. Originally posted by CanterburyStrings:
I just think there are too many variables to decide that one scale length sounds better than another. I just reread this thread, and it turns out YOU'RE the only one who said anything about one sounding better than the other. |
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Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | I guess as a matter of semantics when one says they prefer something it could be deduced that they "like" it better but is it implied that it "sounds better" not necessarily. Just that you like that sound more than another.
now if the two were so totally juxtaposed like say I prefer water as opposed to urine then you may be able to imply that one tastes better than the other because they are such extremes
any way can we all play nice?
I have 2 ft of snow to shovel and will be busy for a while |
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February 2005
Posts: 11840
Location: closely held secret | Go for it, Al. Don't hurt your back. |
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May 2008
Posts: 4996
Location: Phoenix AZ | Just wait 2 months and it'll melt |
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April 2004
Posts: 13303
Location: Latitude 39.56819, Longitude -105.080066 | and don't back the car out over it.
I have a huge tree that shades my entire drive.
If I back out before I shovel I end up having an ice slip for weeks before it will melt away. |
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December 2001
Posts: 10583
Location: NJ | decided to wait till it stops
still snowing and very windy blowin all over the place.
this could be a couple of days before I am mobile again
unless I wave a couple of twenties in front of the kids down the street |
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Posts: 4233
Location: Steeler Nation, Hudson Valley Contingent | Flashing cash to kids on the street in Jersey?
You're a braver man than I am! :p :) |
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I want a 12 fret slothead with a 1-11/16 nut