|
|
Joined:
September 2003
Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | A.J. - muzza - TAFKAR..
What's up with the land down under?
Men At Work are getting screwed.
The flute solos sound nothing alike to me. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2002
Posts: 14127
Location: 6 String Ranch | you should see Colin Hay live when his wife sings the flute solo...... |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2005
Posts: 3736
Location: Sunshine State, Australia | Um... a bit more information Brad? |
|
| |
|
Joined:
September 2003
Posts: 9301
Location: south east Michigan | I intend to Beal!
Here is a link to the story... copyright lawsuit |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2002
Posts: 14127
Location: 6 String Ranch | He had a band when I saw him. Best show I saw all last year. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10777
Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR | I have heard of similar lawsuits, but where do you draw the line.
Should somebody have sued Jimi Hendrix for the Star-Spangled Banner?
How about Traffic for John Barleycorn?
On YouTube somewhere there are some clips that show you how to play a dozen songs with the same chord progression. So this could get complicated.
I am sure that they picked that riff because it was an immediately recognizable Aussie riff.
And the musicians recognized the tune from their childhood.
Just lawyers being greedy. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2009
Posts: 4535
Location: Flahdaw | Originally posted by Old Man Arthur:
Just lawyers being greedy. Allright!!! There's no reason to start insulting greedy people! |
|
| |
|
Joined:
November 2005
Posts: 4832
Location: Campbell River, British Columbia | "Ripping off a 75-year-old Australian folk song"
If you listen, the melodic similarity is obvious. But it's only for the flute solo, which is part of the arrangement, not the song.
Once again a good example that full disclosure in advance will save an ocean of hurt later on.... |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2010
Posts: 15
| Originally posted by Slipkid:
...Men At Work are getting screwed. The flute solos sound nothing alike to me. Right on!
Since Colin Hay has never felt there was any similarity between the two songs, I don't see why... oh, wait a second...
Originally from the articled linked to by Slipkid/Brad:
Justice Jacobson said that Hay's admission he morphed the two songs during some concerts in 2002 helped make his decision.
"Perhaps the clearest illustration of the objective similarity is to be found in Mr Hay's frank admission of a causal connection between the two melodies and the fact that he sang the relevant bars of Kookaburra when performing Down Under at a number of concerts over a period of time from about 2002," Justice Jacobson wrote.
Well, that's just Colin Hay! What does he know about the... erm, I mean...
Wait a moment. What was the original point? :confused:
*chuckle*
----
I've always been amazed at the amount of detail to be gleaned from original sources. Even when there is outrage by those linking to such stories, I normally find that there is something relevant which has been missed.
Is that just my own experience? |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2005
Posts: 3736
Location: Sunshine State, Australia | The song would have been just as popular down here even without the flute solo. And it's not even the whole solo, just the second half of it - that MAY sound SIMILAR.
"Give us 60%!"
Give them nothing! Greedy pricks. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
April 2008
Posts: 2985
Location: Sydney, Australia | It's a small part of the song so give them slightly less than their legal costs. I reckon if we page through all of the classical works we'll find the same riff written 100s of years ago |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2010
Posts: 15
| Originally posted by muzza:
The song would have been just as popular down here even without the flute solo. And it's not even the whole solo, just the second half of it - that MAY sound SIMILAR. If even Hay can man up and say the lines sound the same, then backpedalling from that admission undermines one's credibility.
I can understand not wanting something to be true, but trying to cast doubt on something which has already been admitted isn't helpful.
I'm not arguing about what is a fair settlement, but only about trying to put facts into dispute when they're not in dispute in the first place.
====
Of course, it can be argued that the recorded song would have worked without the flute solo.
But the recording *does* contain the flute solo. If it hadn't, then the lawsuit wouldn't have prevailed.
In any case, as most of the song follows the same melodic contour as "Kookaburra," it will be interesting to see what settlement comes out of the talks.
----
Is the point here that some folks don't want copyright law to prevail? I grew up listening to the Beatles, so of course I want to quote them quite a bit in other songs. Why shouldn't I? *laugh* |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2007
Posts: 672
Location: New South Wales, Australia | I've heard this come up many times in recent years and until it was first brought to my attention I'd never noticed a similarity. Of course, once it was pointed out to me, I coud hear where the two pieces of music (in parts) could be comparable.....but, it's so small (to me at least) that I can't see where the problem is.
I was playing guitar this morning before work and I could be wrong, but I'm sure I played a couple of the exact notes that Mozart played all those years ago. I didn't mean to, it just happened. Hope nobody was listening because I sure can't afford a law suit. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2005
Posts: 3736
Location: Sunshine State, Australia | My objection to the farce is that the song has been around for so long now. The original author didn't have any gripes with M. A. W. before she died. It's only the greedy copyright owner that's looking for an early retirement.
If it's so damn similar, why wasn't this brought up all those years ago when the Kookaburra author was alive?
Coz its NOT that similar.
Like Steve (Ozwatto) I wasn't even aware of the similarity until this cropped up.
FWIW, I was sick of the song by the end of the 80's.
Steve, you need a working letterbox to get the writ, don't you? Even if you DID have a working letterbox, I'm sure your local postie could lose it for you. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2007
Posts: 672
Location: New South Wales, Australia | I have complete faith in my local postie  |
|
| |
|
Joined:
March 2005
Posts: 2791
Location: Atlanta, GA. | All I care to say is, I learned the Kookaburra song in the 4th grade, as part of our music curriculum, and Justice Peter Jacobson of the Federal Court of Australia is FOS!!! |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2006
Posts: 2120
Location: Chicago | Is not Colin Hay playing an Ovation? THIS CLIP |
|
| |
|
Joined:
March 2002
Posts: 14842
Location: NJ | Not.
btw;
In Hay's live shows, the pre-song "banter" is often as "entertaining" as th'music, itself. His annual tours include a church a couple miles from my house . . . |
|
| |
|
Joined:
February 2002
Posts: 5750
Location: Scotland | Originally posted by dobro:
Is not Colin Hay playing an Ovation? THIS CLIP |
|
| |
|
Joined:
December 2008
Posts: 1455
Location: Texas | Originally posted by Beal:
you should see Colin Hay live when his wife sings the flute solo...... Yep, saw them last year, that was impressive.
He puts on a very good show, and you get a bonus comedy routine between songs… ;) |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2004
Posts: 1225
Location: Lake Hiawatha, New Jersey | Originally posted by cliff:
Not.
btw;
In Hay's live shows, the pre-song "banter" is often as "entertaining" as th'music, itself. His annual tours include a church a couple miles from my house . . . I just hope he leaves his wife at home next time (or at least keep her off stage). She was amusing for a song or two, but she really took away from the show. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2005
Posts: 3736
Location: Sunshine State, Australia | Yoko Hay? |
|
| |
|
Joined:
August 2009
Posts: 381
Location: Miami | This is like the Coldplay / Satriani nonsense. I first heard the riffs side by side and thought "copyright infringement for sure", until I calmed down, listened to both whole songs, and realized they are just not the same, in spite of a similar riff here or there. There are so many similar riffs in different sections of different songs that it's endless, and IMO useless to persecute. Unless the similarity is as blatant as Vanilla Ice ripping off "Under Pressure", which anyone with ears can tell is not just a simliar riff, these cases should be thrown out before anyone else makes more money at an artist's expense. Then again with mashups these days like Kid Rock (yuck) biting Warren Zevon and Sweet Home Alabama, it's getting really tricky. But this Men at Work one doesn't even sound like it's anywhere near copyright infringement. So what if he morphed the 2 in a concert? Artists do that all the time! Yeesh. Whatever. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
January 2004
Posts: 1225
Location: Lake Hiawatha, New Jersey | Originally posted by muzza:
Yoko Hay? Funny you should say that. The last time we say Colin Hay, his wife was standing beside him doing some sort of "performance art, dance, singing, flute impression" thing (yes, it's as bad as it sounds). About half way through the show, I asked Cliff "isn't it past Yoko's bedtime??"
She really was annoying. |
|
| |
|
Joined:
May 2003
Posts: 4389
Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | Laches. If it was so obvious, then the author of the kukabera (?) song sat on his rights. The judge should not give him any retroactive relief. |
|
| |
Men At Work fiasco