Buying my First Solid Top 6 String
T.R.
Posted 2015-07-13 9:08 PM (#513444)
Subject: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
May 2015
Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA

Howdy All,

Long time ukulele player that finally crossed over to the larger cousin and got HOOKED on Ovation when I tried my guitar teachers Adamas - it was the first guitar to set in my hands like it felt it should be there. Being a newbie to guitar, and making sure it was gonna stick, I bought a AE 44-5... and well yeah... then got a 1998 CC11 that had been set up with Buzz Feiten Tuning System 18 years ago - and it still sounds insanely great and is my daily player.

Then I found this website.

Now that I am hooked on Ovation -  I would like to add a solid top to my humble stable. I still would like something older - mostly because well 1. I dont have a lot of cash on hand (selling of a couple of ukes on ebay!) 2. want something not to precious I can take to work and play on lunch break and after hours.  Of course I would rather have an old USA model - but I am open to suggestions.  I do prefer mid or deep bowls, like star bursts or color, vs natural...altho asthetics are way less important that the feel and the sound.

I know each model is an individual prefrence but...

 

If you were me what would you look for?

 

 



Edited by Tennessee 2015-07-13 9:10 PM
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alpep
Posted 2015-07-14 9:30 AM (#513452 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String


Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 10581

Location: NJ
plenty on my website

elite T comes to mind but there are many others that may fit the bill
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2wheeldrummer
Posted 2015-07-15 12:01 AM (#513472 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
February 2014
Posts: 700

Location: moline,illinois
A couple questions to determine your preferences.
Do you want a dreadnought or cutaway body
Do you like center hole or muti-soundhole
Do you want a pre-amp or acoustic only

IMHO an older 80'sish legend 1617/1717 a braced is probably the best value for the money
If you like multi-soundholes look for a standard elite
And in reference to your other thread about solid tops,US made balladeers,legends and elites should all be solid tops
Hope this helps
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elginacres
Posted 2015-07-15 1:29 AM (#513474 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String


Joined:
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Location: Colorado
See the for sale section....looks like a nice legend
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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-15 2:51 PM (#513487 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
May 2015
Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA
Ok so it looks like th 70s-80s USA Balladeers are around my price range - they seem to be averaging around $300-400 on Ebay. There seem to be a constant supply of the 1612-4's

I love that Legend in the sale section - its amazing and a fantastic deal - just a little out of my current price range... perhaps I will sell my Resonator Ukulele on ebay as well... course then I would also need to travel to SF...dang it!
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DanSavage
Posted 2015-07-15 3:29 PM (#513490 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
June 2012
Posts: 2303

Location: Lake Forest, CA
IMO, the pre-1981 bowls are more desirable because they're hand-laid, two-ply fiberglass cloth which makes them lighter and more resonant

After 1981, Ovation went to SMC bowls which are thicker and less resonant. The very best bowls are the pre-1968 models, but they can be a little pricey and harder to find.

Edited by DanSavage 2015-07-15 3:30 PM
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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-16 10:19 AM (#513505 - in reply to #513487)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1713

Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
Tennessee - 2015-07-15 2:51 PM

Ok so it looks like th 70s-80s USA Balladeers are around my price range - they seem to be averaging around $300-400 on Ebay. There seem to be a constant supply of the 1612-4's


Hi Tennessee!

I just bought a pristine 1977 Balladeer on ebay for $300, but there is an 1976 Acoustic Sunburst 1121-1, that is in immaculate condition too, that I have been going back and forth on, but decided on the '77 because I was looking for a natural colored top. The '76 has the Original Brown HSC too.

Take a look:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-OVATION-Balladeer-1976-ACOUSTIC-Gui...

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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-16 2:05 PM (#513509 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
May 2015
Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA
@ Nancy - thanks so much!!! I was looking at that one cause it is also listed on craigslist and the seller is two miles away... however I believe this model is a super shallow bowl - I play mostly acoustic so I need a mid or deep bowl... Thanks for lookin out! I do have a bid on the 78 natural 1612-4 - not my first color choice but it looks like it could be a good deal for a daily player - unless I get outbid. http://www.ebay.com/itm/331603415648?_trksid=p2055359.m1431.l2649&s...
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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-16 2:09 PM (#513510 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA
I am selling off my resonator uke, AE-44-5, and Rover Travel guitar on Ebay to raise some more funds in case a Legend comes available... I was looking at the 1982 Ovation Legend Limited w/ Hard case in the sale section but I think it is also a shallow bowl...
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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-16 2:26 PM (#513511 - in reply to #513490)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
May 2015
Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA

@ Dan what do you think about this model 

 Ovation Deluxe Balladeer 2029 Acoustic Guitar - Vintage W/ Hard Case - $450

- its a little rough but perhaps if they came down on the price... its a pawn shop and they like to haggle!

http://losangeles.craigslist.org/sfv/msd/5119400653.html

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jay
Posted 2015-07-16 4:16 PM (#513513 - in reply to #513472)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1249

Location: Texas

 

Drummer is heading in the right direction!

 

"IMHO an older 80'sish legend 1617/1717 a braced is probably the best value for the money"

 

Several on the board feel that the "A" braced Ovations were very consistent in producing the best acoustic resonance. I don't believe the 1617's (legends) were "A" braced, but the 1619's were, as well as the Legend LTD, etc. Paul Moody has harped on this forever and, for once, the cat is right. There is a difference, acoustically, between the legend, balladeers, and the "A" braced Ovations. I have had a 81 CL, a 40th CL and a 1651 and all of them, acoustically (to me) were more balanced and resonant than other Ovations I have owned (except for the shinys).  If you are going to plug in, then you don't have to be quite as picky.  Good luck with your journey.

 

-----------------------------------------------------

Tennessee,

 

That should be a 68 Deluxe Balladeer Shiny bowl (although it doesn’t look shiny), with the serial of 2029 or 2429... It appears to need a bath, but the biggest concern is if the neck is falling into the hole. There are not very many people around that can correct that malady, which requires a bowl bend.The remaining concerns would have to be on inspection.

Those shiny's had "it". Mr Kaman hit it out of the park with the first ones. As much as the company evolved, I personally dont think they ever exceeded the acoustic tonal qualities of the first ones to leave the factory.  All handmade, btw.

 



Edited by jay 2015-07-16 4:17 PM
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Damon67
Posted 2015-07-16 4:39 PM (#513515 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Location: Jet City
The 1617 started with VT bracing while the 1619 had A bracing, but the 1617 changed to A-bracing just before the Kaman bar came into play (somewhere around 1980). All Kaman bar 1617s have A-braced tops

I'm unsure of when the balladeers, artists, etc made the switch if they ever did.
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jay
Posted 2015-07-16 6:27 PM (#513519 - in reply to #513515)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1249

Location: Texas

Thanks Damon...I was totally unaware that the Legend transitioned into the A bracing.  Sorry for the misinformation. 

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2wheeldrummer
Posted 2015-07-16 8:47 PM (#513526 - in reply to #513510)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 700

Location: moline,illinois
Tennessee - 2015-07-16 2:09 PM

I am selling off my resonator uke, AE-44-5, and Rover Travel guitar on Ebay to raise some more funds in case a Legend comes available... I was looking at the 1982 Ovation Legend Limited w/ Hard case in the sale section but I think it is also a shallow bowl...


Hey Tennessee if you go to the FAQ section there is a page that beaks down which models have which bowls plus theres some other pages that break down color codes and decyphering model numbers.
Almost all the ovations made in the 70's are deep bowls with the exception of the ones labeled artist bowls which are similar to mid depth.Legend limited models are deep bowls.

Edited by 2wheeldrummer 2015-07-16 8:50 PM
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Cavalier
Posted 2015-07-17 10:25 AM (#513540 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String


Joined:
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Posts: 359

Location: undisclosed
I never expected to plug these guys but Guitar Center often has good pricing on Ovations online. I found that when you call the stores the staff tend to be really forthcoming about condition. I picked up a mid 80s 1117 with a added pickup and case in excellent condition for $250.
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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-17 10:52 AM (#513542 - in reply to #513526)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA

Ok I feel like a comlete idiot for having earched for a few hours online researching bowl depths when all the info was here in FAQ in an easy to read spreadsheet.

 

Realizing that years from now I will look back at my first few threads and cringe...

 

Ah the internet - it records it all - good and bad - for... ever.

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Damon67
Posted 2015-07-17 11:08 AM (#513543 - in reply to #513540)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



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Location: Jet City

Cavalier - 2015-07-17 8:25 AM  I found that when you call the stores the staff tend to be really forthcoming about condition...

 

YMMV on this. While I've had some really good buys, I've had quite a few that were completely misrepresented, not to mention some of the packing jobs they've done when shipping. To list everything would be a pretty long post, but I've had guitars show up that were damaged (obviously before shipment), shipped without their case (and hardly any wrap, just flopping around in the box), one showed up with a home done scalloped fretboard without disclosure.

When dealing with GC, I always ask very detailed and complete questions and ask the sales guy to do what he can to be sure they pack it properly.

They do have a 30 day return policy. It's the only reason I'll still deal with them on used stuff.



Edited by Damon67 2015-07-17 11:09 AM
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jay
Posted 2015-07-17 11:39 AM (#513544 - in reply to #513543)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1249

Location: Texas

Additionally, I have found that asking the rep to send you some up close pics is beneficial, as GC's website pictures are useless. Most of them have cell phones and will text or email them to you rather quickly.

 

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Mark in Boise
Posted 2015-07-17 11:52 AM (#513545 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String


Joined:
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Posts: 12750

Location: Boise, Idaho
Please consider my advice with the following disclaimer: I really miss the Patriot I had and I'm stewing over the Legend Limited in the For Sale section.
I agree with those above who recommend an A-braced Legend. I think, but I'm not sure, that the Patriots, 1651s, Legend Limiteds fell in that category. The Patriots and the John Lennon reissues were the best sounding Ovations, to my ear. I thought the Patriot held a slight edge over my 04 Commemorative CL, probably because of the age and lack of electronics in the Patriot. So, I recommend you check out Al's guitars at Lost Art Vintage before you take any more chances with Craigslist or Guitar Center. Al will give you an honest appraisal of anything he's got. If none of those suit you, I'd go for the Legend Limited in the For Sale section. I'm sure you could work with the seller or somebody like Stonebobbo to arrange transportation between San Francisco and LA. If you don't I may have to buy it and pick it up the next time I visit Bobbo or my daughter in California. You need that guitar much more than I do, so save me the hassle.
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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-17 12:54 PM (#513548 - in reply to #513542)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1713

Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
Tennessee - 2015-07-17 10:52 AM

Ok I feel like a comlete idiot for having earched for a few hours online researching bowl depths when all the info was here in FAQ in an easy to read spreadsheet.

 

Realizing that years from now I will look back at my first few threads and cringe...

 

Ah the internet - it records it all - good and bad - for... ever.



Please don't ever feel bad, we all started out new here, and these Folks are GREAT about sharing information and knowledge. They have helped me SO much, and I have learned SO much just by asking questions, even if I felt they were stupid, they never treated me, or made me feel stupid for asking!

And you will never beat my stupid *glitter* post I made while overly tired, so don't feel bad!! LOL!!!!
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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-17 12:54 PM (#513549 - in reply to #513542)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1713

Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
Sorry for the double post...

Edited by Nancy 2015-07-17 12:57 PM
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Cavalier
Posted 2015-07-17 3:31 PM (#513551 - in reply to #513543)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String


Joined:
March 2013
Posts: 359

Location: undisclosed
damon67 - 2015-07-17 9:08 AM

Cavalier - 2015-07-17 8:25 AM  I found that when you call the stores the staff tend to be really forthcoming about condition...

 

YMMV on this. While I've had some really good buys, I've had quite a few that were completely misrepresented, not to mention some of the packing jobs they've done when shipping. To list everything would be a pretty long post, but I've had guitars show up that were damaged (obviously before shipment), shipped without their case (and hardly any wrap, just flopping around in the box), one showed up with a home done scalloped fretboard without disclosure.

When dealing with GC, I always ask very detailed and complete questions and ask the sales guy to do what he can to be sure they pack it properly.

They do have a 30 day return policy. It's the only reason I'll still deal with them on used stuff.



I did all the same things, got them to check on packing, pictures etc.... I think some of it comes down to the rapport with the staff you get. Connecting with them as a musician versus sales/ customer helps. Many really don't care if you buy or not and will be straight. If you seem fussy about packaging the incentive is there to make sure it is done right. The go nogo point for me is if it looks like too good a deal not to take a chance on.
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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-17 7:10 PM (#513556 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA
@Nancy - Thanks so much for your kind words! AND thanks for the link!! After I read the spreadsheet in FAQ I felt like an idiot for not bidding on the 76 1211-1 - since it was just what I was looking for - sunburst, all acoustic, fiberglass bowl, local seller, around $300... This morning over coffee I checked my current auctions and did my obsessive Ovation USA guitar search I noticed the high bidder had backed out!! I contacted the seller and went and looked at the guitar at lunch today it was awesome... the freekin brown case was even in great shape - what the what...$300 bucks.

So my first solid top is a 1976 1211-1 Artist. Damn now I know what you all have been talking about. The build is amazing - I can't believe this girl is almost as old as me! She sits so perfectly agains my little belly - must be half the weight of my CC11 and the bowl is just a little shallower - but projects !!

Now I begin saving for the cherryburst elite 1778lx usa Al has for sale at www.LostArtVintage.com - should it still be available in eight months... a boy can dream!!
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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-17 8:47 PM (#513558 - in reply to #513556)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
CONGRATULATIONS Tennessee!!!!!!

GREAT NEWS!!!!! I have been watching that one for long time, he finally came down to $300 from $500, and I am just thrilled that you got to see it, and play it before buying too!!! That one has the most Beautiful Sunburst! The black is more feathered in from the airbrush than most, and is Gorgeous!!!

I am really happy that you like her so much, and she will be in the Family!!!! There is something Very Special about the mid-seventies Ovations, to me, they are the Best sounding, and have *that Ovation sound* like no other guitar!

Congratulations on a Wonderful new/old Friend!!!!
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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-17 9:18 PM (#513559 - in reply to #513544)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
amosmoses - 2015-07-17 11:39 AM

Additionally, I have found that asking the rep to send you some up close pics is beneficial, as GC's website pictures are useless. Most of them have cell phones and will text or email them to you rather quickly.

 



Scaring the daylights out of them works too!
When I found my 1976 Custom Legend at Sam Ash Used, I called and told the young man that I was a BIG, MEAN, UGLY Woman, and wanted him to go get the guitar, hold it in front of himself, and give me EVERY detail, good and bad about that Guitar! He did, then I threatened bodily harm if there was one mark caused by incompetent shipping, and by Gosh! That was the most well packed Guitar I have ever seen!

He knew I was funning him, but we got along so well, he wanted to do right by me, and I was very appreciative of his good help, and let the President know how much I appreciated his young, honest Associate.

Buying sight unseen can be a crapshoot (remember the poor Patriot I got with no box???) But I have been very lucky other than that one.

Edited by Nancy 2015-07-17 9:19 PM
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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-20 6:50 PM (#513614 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA
<p>So is it complete blasphemy to put a Vintage 1121 in a newer black case? The black one I got with my C11 fits my new/old 1121 better than the brown one the 1121 came with.</p>

Edited by Tennessee 2015-07-20 6:51 PM
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TAFKAR
Posted 2015-07-20 7:05 PM (#513615 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Location: Sydney, Australia
Blasphemy is leaving it on the couch where kids/dogs can get at it
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Darkbar
Posted 2015-07-21 5:19 AM (#513624 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



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Location: Flahdaw
It's only blasphemy if the black case has the Taylor logo on it.
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BanjoJ
Posted 2015-07-21 6:46 AM (#513627 - in reply to #513624)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Location: Thredbo, NSW, Australia
darkbarguitar - 2015-07-21 10:19 PM

It's only blasphemy if the black case has the Taylor logo on it.


Keeping an Ovation in a Taylor case will greatly reduce the chance of theft.
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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-21 9:16 AM (#513640 - in reply to #513627)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
BanjoJ - 2015-07-21 6:46 AM

darkbarguitar - 2015-07-21 10:19 PM

It's only blasphemy if the black case has the Taylor logo on it.


Keeping an Ovation in a Taylor case will greatly reduce the chance of theft.


LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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arumako
Posted 2015-07-22 3:10 AM (#513662 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1018

Location: Yokohama, Japan
Whoa! Nice pick-up for $300! I saw her on the bay too, but I live in Japan, and the shipping is just murder! Besides, I'm saving for a new USA O, but a great deal is a great deal no matter what. And when an OFC'er gets a nice O, it just kinda feels good! When you get her all cleaned up post some pics, please!
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T.R.
Posted 2015-07-24 9:16 PM (#513740 - in reply to #513662)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 186

Location: Glendora, CA

UPDATE:  So now a few days have passed since I got my new/old friend. I am definitely pleased with my purchase - however I think $300 was about the right price - hopefully not too much.

I affectionately call it Mr Tobacco Burst, not just cause he has an amazing brown burst on him…but also because the former owner must been a chain smoker - I didn’t notice when I picked him up because the musician lived above an old bar and his place already smelled like a chimney. The case smells just fine interestingly, but when I strum him an odor that is reminesant of my "grandpappy the pipe smoker" wafts from his belly. I have Mr Tobacco Burst hanging up in my office at work now and I am hoping that might help over time to dissipate the stink. I am also contemplating sticking an odor eater in his bowl when he is not being played!

Other observations - the top also has a bit of a bow in it between the bridge and the neck - and the saddle is definately at its last lowest adjustment. Still with the new strings the action is still pretty perfect and there is no fret buzz - so I at least have some miles left on him before shipping him to the mothership - assuming it would be worth the cost.

 

After removing the old strings I discovered the fret board looked like it hadn’t been cleaned since…well maybe 1976. Some nice OOOO steel wool and some F-ONE Oil and now it does look and feel pretty perfect. He plays and sounds fantastic. I still really love how he feels in my hands and lap. I LOVE his sound.  Was he as advertised... “rarely played - kept in case its whole life, no scratches or dents” no - of course not - he has surface scratches, four distinct small dings in his top, and has clearly been played enough to crud up the fretboard... but then again he was born 40 or so years ago! So IMHO he is great shape for his age…wish I could say the same! 

76 Artist

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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-24 9:40 PM (#513741 - in reply to #513740)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
It looks absolutely Gorgeous!!!

My '77 Custom Balladeer had a faint smell of mold in it, and I lightly sprayed some Lysol in it, and let it sit overnight. Took all the smell away! Smoke will probably take a bit more, and throwing a downy dryer sheet in can help in the meantime, but it masks the smell, not eliminates it. But you could try the Lysol, it kills it.

It sure is Pretty, I am glad that it sounds so good too! Enjoy! We all have a few scars from life, they add character, as long as it is not broken or warped, it sounds like a nice Beastie!
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nerdydave
Posted 2015-07-24 11:43 PM (#513742 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String


Joined:
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Location: Always beautiful canyon country of Utah
That guitar is beyond beautiful!! I have always lusted after a sunburst but so far have not taken the time or effort to procure one!!
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2015-07-24 11:47 PM (#513743 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 10777

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR
Just a personal observation...
Don't use Febreeze.
I sprayed some of that in my 1868T's case a few years ago... Feb 2012.
It still stinks like Febreeze... which my be worse than the original musty smell.

The Odor-Eater insole sounds like a good idea.
Just stick it in halfway through the strings into the soundhole when you aren't playing it.
I like that idea.
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stonebobbo
Posted 2015-07-25 5:33 PM (#513750 - in reply to #513444)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 8307

Location: Tennessee
Try Ozium for getting rid of odors. It has worked fantastically for everything I've needed it for. It takes a away the smell as opposed to trying to cover it up.


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Nancy
Posted 2015-07-26 9:52 AM (#513761 - in reply to #513750)
Subject: Re: Buying my First Solid Top 6 String



Joined:
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Posts: 1713

Location: Frozen Tundra of Minnesota
stonebobbo - 2015-07-25 5:33 PM

Try Ozium for getting rid of odors. It has worked fantastically for everything I've needed it for. It takes a away the smell as opposed to trying to cover it up.




Thank You Stonebobbo!
That stuff sounds great, I am going to get some my stored car!!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Ozium-Smoke-Odor-Eliminator-Air-Sanitizer-F...

Edited by Nancy 2015-07-26 9:53 AM
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