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August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | There, I've said it, now I feel better.
Gradually, as I've played guitars with the different bowl sizes, realized that good engineering/design is more important than the bowl size.
First mid-bowl was the 6759 CL 12-str - almost didn't get it as I thought the mid-bowl would be inferior. Then Millennium. Just got Dan's mid-bowl Adamas SMT 6-str. Sure, got some great deep bowls. Prefer to play them acoustically v. my Martin.
However, it comes back to playing position - IMHO, more important than the bowl size.
We see that in the LX mid-bowl. Will be interesting to see the new LX 12-str. Gone are the days where performers stood on the outdoor stage with a dreadnought/jumbo and with only a microphone to amplify. As to the SMT and CVT v. the textured top - the Adamas I and II will always be my favorite but the SMT and CVT models are wonderful sounding and playing guitars.
Best acoustic 12 that I have is the GC - I believe because the cavity is empty; even the 1158 CL that I used to have sounded better than the a/e 1658 that I have now. Yet, always wished that I had the a/e model (passive Lawrence centerhole p/u was an accident waiting to happen with the cord hanging down.)
As to a/e's - favorite 6-str is a dead heat with the 30th Anniv CL and the Adamas I (equal but different); favorite 12-str has to be the Adamas I that I recently got from Chris Choate (made in 2003.) |
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December 2003
Posts: 83
Location: New Mexico | I'm certainly in no position to dispute anything you have said (beginner) but certainly admire you going on record with your thoughts. I would like to know what you think of the Q598. I just received mine and I think it's brilliant. 20 years ago or so I had a mint unused 1658 and gave it to a friend for Xmas because I thought I was too busy to learn. Also I am looking to pick up a new or mint used 6 string Ovation/Adamas but not sure what model. Not having the experience or knowledge, I am leary of used. Suggestions?
Thanks. |
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Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | Tony-
You'd give up even the mid-bowls if you could play my Elite shallow bowl. It's possessed by the spirit of a long dead, dear departed deep bowl, I think. Just last night, I was working my way through 'Spooky' and danged if the bass notes didn't, all on their own I swear, ring out full and loud...loud enough to wake my wife who had dozed off on the couch and was quite explicit in expressing her unhappiness at having been awoken.
Or maybe it's just possessed and wants to get me into trouble. Huh. OK. I've changed my mind, it's clearly trying to get rid of the wife so it can just be me and the guitar. Hrmm. Must be a female guitar then...
:) |
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Joined:
April 2004
Posts: 795
Location: Texas | Tony,
I have to agree with you, again.
To me, mid bowl is the way to go, it is comfortable and has great projection.
The Artist series are my favorites, the Glen Campbell I just got sounds and feels wonderful, and of course I love the Country Artist nylon string model.
And, I have to say that my Adamas 1881-5 shallow bowl, "The Black Queen", has great tone, projection and volume and beats the crap out of most of my other deep bowl wood top Ovations.
Serge ;)
www.sergiolara.com |
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Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | Derby, problem I have is that you can't find many O's and A's to play without buying first. Never seen the Q. Imagine if you couldn't test drive a car before buying? Have to believe that at least Al or Paul T. have had the opportunity to play. Maybe they can compare.
Your guitar is nt the end result of the Q project but have to believe it is a great instrument.
As to suggestions...again, haven't found an Ovation I didn't like. Guess that is the basis for my other thread. And, my preferences keep changing. Last year, the only thing I wanted was dark sunburst Custom Legend (contrast w/abalone). Now, I like the natural CL also. Last year, I had no interest in the non-mid bowl, electric (like the Ultra or Storm series), multi-hole, cutaway, or Adamas. Again, tried them, like them.
Still a basic center hole, non-cutaway deep bowl, abalone, abalone, abalone. Was only interested in having one 6-str (1619 CL), now have about 15 (still prefer the 12-string.) Thought the Balladeer was the "plain jane." Not anymore.
Guess the bottom line is I haven't found an Ovation or Adamas I didn't like. Confused? I know I am. |
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December 2003
Posts: 83
Location: New Mexico | I wouldn't say I was confused but I am positive I would not want to get into a debate with you. Kinda like asking my wife to read the map while I drive.
Thanks for the thoughts... :D |
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Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | re: "You'd give up even the mid-bowls if you could play my Elite shallow bowl. It's possessed by the spirit of a long dead, dear departed deep bowl, I think."
That's the basis of my posting...it isn't necessarily the bowl. Great engineering over depth of the bowl. There has been discussion about not buying a model merely because of the bowl depth - used to be my opinion also.
I understand the aesthetics and preference issue. And, side by side, the deep bowl may be "sweeter" to the ear. Yet, acoustically, I really don't believe we lose much to go to the shallower bowls if it results in a better playing position or comfort. Unlike a wood box, engineering with the O's and A's can adjust for the loss of depth. Course, plugged in is another matter - remember, Les Paul's first electric was a 2X4. |
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Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | re: "You'd give up even the mid-bowls if you could play my Elite shallow bowl. It's possessed by the spirit of a long dead, dear departed deep bowl, I think."
That's the basis of my posting...it isn't necessarily the bowl. Great engineering over depth of the bowl. There has been discussion about not buying a model merely because of the bowl depth - used to be my opinion also.
I understand the aesthetics and preference issue. And, side by side, the deep bowl may be "sweeter" to the ear. Yet, acoustically, I really don't believe we lose much to go to the shallower bowls if it results in a better playing position or comfort. Unlike a wood box, engineering with the O's and A's can adjust for the loss of depth. Course, plugged in is another matter - remember, Les Paul's first electric was a 2X4. |
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November 2002
Posts: 1196
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana | Tony, say it isn't so! (lol) What happened to out talks about the great sound of the deep bowl Custom Legends. OOOO ok, the Legend LX is a mid-bowl and it sounds awesome. Whatever (lol) :D |
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January 2002
Posts: 14127
Location: 6 String Ranch | I think they need to make a bowl that is 6 inches deeped than the old deep bowl. That would have some bass!!! |
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November 2002
Posts: 1196
Location: Lafayette, Louisiana | CWK2, how did Ovation come up with the size of the original bowl in the first place? Was there alot of testing done to get this right? |
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Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | Originally posted by Legend-LX-Fan:
CWK2, how did Ovation come up with the size of the original bowl in the first place? Was there alot of testing done to get this right?
They had this really cool desk in the lobby, but nobody could play it. Someone, probably W2, said, 'You know, if it were n% smaller...' and thus it was.
:) |
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April 2003
Posts: 2503
Location: Fayetteville, NC | I knew there was a story that I hadn't heard!
by the way, I'm a Mid depth fan too. The projection on the 1858 12 string I own is OUTSTANDING! |
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July 2003
Posts: 1922
Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | Just got back from a shop comparing the new Al DiMeola CL deep-bowl to a 1777 Legend non-LX mid-bowl....the ADII definitely has more rumble and richness. My wife agreed.
Nothing wrong with mid-bowl, it depends on what you want.
Roger |
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January 2002
Posts: 14127
Location: 6 String Ranch | The first bowl was #6 and it was too deep. So from there they shrunkit down to something that was comfortable which was the deep. They also put it the waist flat spots then so it would stay on your knee better than #6. It was probably like "put these flats in the waitst and take 2" off it and lets see how that feels. OH I like that, OK that's it!" |
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May 2004
Posts: 295
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada | Now that I have a new Adamas on the way, I started thinking that maybe I should sell my Elite model 1718. Then I thought, maybe I should hang on to it; the Mother Ship no longer makes this model and, after all, it IS a deep-bowl.
Now, what I'm inferring from this thread is that perhaps deep-bowls are not such a big deal in terms of better sound and desirability, so my Elite may not really be all that "collectible," and I should therefore not hang on to it. What say you, OFC? Is an early 1990's Elite 1718 (no dings, dents, finish cracks or other cracks, sunburst finish, OP24) something you'd think about adding to your collection? I take it as a given that the usual OFC suspects will offer me $79.98 to "take it off my hands." |
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Joined:
August 2003
Posts: 4619
Location: SoCal | Well, how about $179.98? ;)
Personally, I would prefer a deep bowl; my only point was that later mid and shallow bowls, properly engineered (balanced with the top), are still great instruments. |
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May 2003
Posts: 79
Location: Toronto, Canada | Duncan,
Is that CAD$79.98 for your Elite? :D
Sorry, could not resist! Let us know when the Adamas arrives!
wemedge |
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Joined:
May 2004
Posts: 2850
Location: Midland, MI | Just to be clear, all of *my* offers are in USian dollars. No funny money offers here. No siree!
:0 |
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my confession-deeper bowl is not necessarily better
