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Location: Freeport, IL | Treat others the way that you like to be treated - speak to others in the way in which you like to be spoken to - golden rule - works really well.
Later,
Jon Van Gilder |
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Location: Pacific Northwest Inland Empire | I always thought that line was from Dan Hicks & His Hot Licks. Always appropos, though. |
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Location: Houston, TX | I'm not sure when Christians became so intolerent (historically, probably always with graduating intensity), but it seems a bit hypocritical, and born out of guilt and fear. I would hope that if people feel inspired by their chosen religion, then that dogma would inspire them to focus on the positive aspects of human behavior and action, or at least the potential for us all serve each other and do good work. This bit that has been playing out here for the last couple of days seems Puritanical, and judgemental, and assuming the WORST out of people.
I read the most ridiculous thing this morning - It was a post about how a guy has tempered his speech to say "heck" instead of "hell". (Hang in there with me here) The implication seems to be that one word is more appropriate and less vile - and therefore by definition a little more correct, acceptable, tolerable, pallatible...a little closer to holy than the other word. I find it absurd that these 2 words express the same sentiment - and yet only a gutteral linguistic difference, crafted by a slightly different compression in the larynx and slightly different posture of the mouth, tongue, and teeth - is all that separates these words. I try to be aware of the significance I place on the rules of men (which are sometimes arbitrary, and nearly always politically or financially motivated) versus the laws of the universe (still with me?). Survive and Prosper, and help everything you see and know to survive and prosper - that's my dogma. Thee rest is bulldamheckpoop. |
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Location: Minden, Nebraska | Scott,
Your point on the difference between saying "heck" and "hell" is well taken. Motive and intention trump the actual word. However, the value of the choice of words increases relative to the context of its application. Some things are best not said in certain social contexts, even if felt. I had some choice comments in response to the Nebraska game yesterday that were best left in my own mind, given that my wife was in the next room. Maybe I am old fashioned in thinking that some language is inappropriate around others as a matter of honoring and respecting them.
However, your description of intolerance by Christians paints a very large number of people with a broad brush. One person's faith has been given expression on this board recently in relationship to the subject of this thread. That hardly makes this a religious issue, imho. |
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Location: south east Michigan | I agree. I know what "frigging" really stands for and I won't let my kids get away with it. I know how they talk when they are around their peers, I just need them to know that there are times to govern themselves.
And just as I did not like being painted with a broad brush, I would not lump in all Christians as the same as the recent threads might indicate. |
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Location: Warren,Pa. | I guess I misunderstood. I'm sorry. I thought it was one of the house rules that we keep our language clean on this board. I also see that tolerance only works DOWN. We should not be tolerant of people who are offended by our rough language. THEY are supposed to be tolerant of US. I see that tolerance is a one-way issue. I think it's a shame that we parade our street talk like a proud banner, and tell Lisa to F#@* herself as she leaves with her intolerance. For myself, I try to RAISE the bar in consideration of others, rather than fight for my right to do what I want, when I want, because I want. John <>{ |
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Posts: 782
Location: Waurika OK | "The purpose of this site is to inform, educate, communicate and share knowledge of Ovation guitars."
The above is a direct quote from the welcome page of this website.
When I found this forum, I was glad it existed.
I am a preacher, I did not join it to preach or promote my faith.
I have some strong feelings about politics, but I did not join to promote those feelings.
I am a proud American citizen, but I did not join to be able to exercise all my rights.
1. I joined for the personal satisfaction of learning more about my beloved Ovation, how to care for it, maintain it and knowledge that I did even know I needed to know. (and evidently to get a bad case of G.A.S.)
2. I hoped that I might add to the mutual satisfaction and enjoyment of all the other members, although my limitations are apparent and my knowledge and experience are not as great as most of you.
If I get too far away from the stated purpose of this forum, I begome divisive, whether or not that is my intention. Or for whatever reason, however valid I may feel it to be.
I leave you with a quote from a friend of mine:
"Remember, honey, it ain't all about you."
noel |
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| "I guess I misunderstood. I'm sorry. I thought it was one of the house rules that we keep our language clean on this board."
We do for the most part?
It's people who begin to change what is considered "Clean" or at least try to get the Poor Guy's who are in charge of us bunch of nut's to scold us! That I have a problem with.
I am sorry but if you feel like you have been hit by a hammer when you read a word like Hell, or Shit? Man it's just a typed set of letters on a computer screen? I just don't see the problem. I don't know but it seems to me that everyone in the real world, I live in, have more pressing problems than language on a site we just joined?
Al's point about kids on the site are well taken! Well taken!
I am sure if any kid ever asked a question about their guitar, or whatever, there is not one guy on this site that would not have the social graces to answer them in a manner that would make us all proud.
Live and let Live man. Randy
Noel Nice post. |
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Location: Waurika OK | Lest I be misunderstood:
My above post was intended for ALL 2570 members of the Ovation Fan Club.
By the way, welcome Rudy.
noel |
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Posts: 15680
Location: SoCal | Reading all of the above postings, and profanity aside, this is a thinkging man's (or woman's) group of people.
I'm proud to be here!
Now I've just got to think a little more. Tough to do when you've been wacked in the head as much as me. But I'll try. |
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Location: Canton (Detroit), MI | Nils' original question is a fair one. Here is my answer for myself only; I try to keep my responses to such that I am comfortable that a lady or child who just wandered into the board could read it without embarassment.
Roger |
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Location: NJ | I don't think it is too much to ask to consider the audience.
There is no way we can determine that someone is female or underage when they sign up for this board.
I again do not promote censorship but gratuitous use of profanity does seem rather low class and out of place. Of course I don't want to be the one who determines when the use of profanity is needed either.
Just remember our rule. Be nice to one another. |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | In addition to what Al said, remember that you are not just "REPLYING" to one person who asks a question. Your thoughts and comments are a permenent record on the Internet accessable to millions.
I too don't understand "swearing" on a chat board, althought I think I've done it, I realize it isn't right.
Now what does this thread have to do with guitars? |
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Location: puerto vallarta, mexico | if we didn't swear in mexico it would take half the time to say anything in spanish.
vamos a la pinche playa chingones y cavrones. |
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Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada | Whew...I logged on to the OFC this morning after being off-line for the weekend, only to find I'd been hammered as being ridiculous for substituting "heck" for "hell."
Since my comment was in a thread that appears to have been deleted, I'd like to remind the OFC of the context. I was saying that I avoid even mild swearing when teaching kids in martial arts class. Whether I deserve it or not, some of those kids look up to me and, although I'm sure they've heard every cuss word there is out there in the big bad world (hell...er...heck, they've probably heard some I don't know about), at least they're going to see that this particular adult can get by without them. There are no moral overtones to this; as far as I'm concerned, a well placed cuss word can add a nice emphasis to a point. It's just that overuse of cuss words makes them lose their intended impact, like a novel with an exclamation point at the end of every sentence. I find it irritating that most times when I walk by a group of young people talking these days, it seems every second word is "fuck" or "shit"; it's irritating because it makes them sound déclassé, and not because it offends my delicate sensibilities.
I would also mention that my earlier posting pointed out that my language can get a bit more colorful when teaching the adults.
Finally, there seemed to be an implication that my "prudishness" is somehow linked to Christian intolerance. As a diehard atheist, I found that somewhat amusing. |
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Location: Seattle | Reminds me of going to confession when I was about 12 and telling the priest that I had "cussed" 5 times. He suggested I read the sportspage to see how creatively the writers used language and to try to do the same instead of resorting to "cussing". That advice led to the use of the term "Go grand slam yourself".
Sonny |
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Location: Fayetteville, NC | Sonny,
That's one I've never heard before. It's great!
I gotta remember that one. :D |
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Location: The Great Pacific Northwest | That's one thing I wish we would have inherited from the Brits. That ability to insult someone with so much panache that they feel honored to have been verbally pummeled.
There are some great insults to be hurled in Italian, Yiddish, German and Hebrew, but they loose so much in translation so the Britwits are my favorite, although I have heard some old school Southern gentlemen raps that would just floor ya. |
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Location: south east Michigan | I think I was the last to post on that deleted topic. I might have hit a nerve. I won't comment again on this board. If your interested, e-mail me. |
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Location: Houston, TX | Duncan J,
I made the comment about "heck" and "hell", but I wasn't referring to you - I don't remember reading your post and certainly have no desire to wade through all that stuff again. What I read about profanity came from an editorial piece about morality and parenting in the newsletter from a local church that spams our mailbox every week or two - nothing related to OFC. I was just using the analogy to make a point. Similarly, the Christian intolerance I spoke of was in no way directed at you. It was pointed out to me that such broad strokes of sterotyping (saying that all Christians are intolerant by definition) are not usually fair - and I agree. My point would probably have been more clear if I had said "many people involved in the current wave of fundementalism..." or something like that.
Anyway, no need to revisit the whole debate - I just wanted to let you know I wasn't targeting you. |
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Location: High, in the Rocky Mountains of Colorado | Dang, there are sure some mighty good folks here! It's a pleasure most of the time to read everyones input. I'm proud to be a member!
I also use the words "dang", "heck", "shoot" and other replacements... It "is" because I'm a puss... It does not bother me to read it, certainly not to say it, I just hate to write it...
I love four letter words, any more than that and I can't spell them...
To me it aint the words used, it's the attitude of how the words are used, any words... |
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Location: Lake Hiawatha, New Jersey | "To me it aint the words used, it's the attitude of how the words are used, any words... "
Well, said.
It's interesting, to me anyway, that there has been so much commotion over the "proper edicate" for this group. Overall, I think it's been great.
As I see it, many of us visit daily, and the sense community and friendship is just fantastic. The regulars are like family, and the interplay among everyone, for me, is fun and often very funny. As people become comfortable with each other, and get to know each other, certain things fly and become acceptable that perhaps wouldn't in a business or church social settings. It's part of everyone being who they are and feeling the freedom to let down their guard. It's just natural, and to any new onlooker, it may seem strange or unacceptable.
I had a grandfather who would belch and fart at the dinner table without even thinking twice. Is that offensive? In church, you bet. In his own home, yeah, but who cares. Across the table at Thanksgiving from the in-laws who were straight-laced Catholic and very proper? Depends who's house you're in, I guess.
Buttons might be pushed as new members come in. In my experience here, there have been extremely few incidents of offensively driven, viscious attacks on anyone using foul language (anything of that nature I feel should be dealt with). Of course, I realize that my values are very different than someone elses, and I may actually be desensitized somewhat to what is considered offensive. But, part of being part of any group is learning to roll with those things that rub you the wrong way-that's just maturity. Just like grandpa farting at the table, ya either ignore it, or say "ewe" and accept it as part of who grandpa is and love him anyway, or choose to find it funny, or leave the room and be offended. You choose the experience, all the man did was fart. Eventually the air will clear, and the conversation will continue. What will you have missed if you left the room?
S'pose I'll just wrap up and say that, in general, I've really liked the way things have been here for the last year or so. To me, it's worked really well-there are really good hearted people in this group. I like the non-related tangents that threads take, the humor, wit, the busting on each other, and quite frankly, none the cursing has ever offended me. It's perfect in its imperfection.
I'd really hate to see this stuff change because people ever feel the need to have to edit themselves. It's really sad when some major contributors to this board don't post because someone else has been offended by them.
Johnny |
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Location: Capital District, NY, USA Minor Outlying Islands | Won't this topic and related threads die? The Horror! The Horror!
Joseph Conrad/Marlin Brando |
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Location: SoCal | Well said Johnny!
But don't worry. I'll be damned if I'm ever gonna change! |
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Location: Upper Left USA | From somewhere back in the anals of written media's history:
"I has seen the enemy, and it is us'n" |
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How *nice* are we expected to be?
