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I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.

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Blue Guitar
Posted 2020-05-29 3:31 PM (#552186)
Subject: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.


Joined:
May 2020
Posts: 6

Location: Perth Australia
I have a 1982 collectors series I have had it from new. But as I was setting up the intonation and I went to adjust the Kaman bar truss rod, but the brass flange nut was missing. I lent the guitar to a musician about 8 years ago, he must have applied to much pressure to the brass flange nut and stripped the thread. The flange screws onto a steel nut, the reason it’s brass is so the flange gets stripped not the steel thread. I have ordered a new one and a spare from France, the only place in the world that has them. $75 total, mainly for postage, it would have cost me $60 for one, I also ordered three .75mm Bridge shims. To make the neck perfect will only require a quarter turn of the flange nut.

Anyway is a magnificent guitar, very rare in Australia, my dad bought it for me and brought it back from the USA in 1982. The 1982 collectors series was never sold here in Australia, it might be the only one here. Need to be carful with vintage guitars, particularly Ovations, heavy gauge strings cause bridge lifting problems. So I use a 10 gauge light string, and tune it down a step. Perfect for playing Yesterday in the key of E but sounding like F. Brilliant musician that Paul, ... and John AND George ... LoL, even Ringo. George is my favourite guitar player.

I want to see two renowned Perth luthiers, they told me the guitar was stuffed, throw it away they said, can’t be fixed. How wrong they are, they just don’t understand Kaman truss rods , it’s really terrible, and I am a bit angry....don’t give Advice if you don’t know. But luthiers are like that, they all have huge heads, to them clockwise is really anti clockwise....literally on truss nut turn direction.

On old Ovations don’t used heavy strings, use no more than .10 E. As over time the bridge will pull up. Very expensive fix.

My 2 cents worth from Oz.

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Blue Guitar
Posted 2020-05-29 3:37 PM (#552187 - in reply to #552186)
Subject: RE: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.


Joined:
May 2020
Posts: 6

Location: Perth Australia
Opps, typo, tune guitar down a tone, play in G and sound like F. Sorry does my head in.
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Blue Guitar
Posted 2020-05-29 4:46 PM (#552188 - in reply to #552186)
Subject: RE: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.


Joined:
May 2020
Posts: 6

Location: Perth Australia

Brass flange nut.

Missing Flange nut. The brass flange nut, it’s brass so it gets its thread striped and not the male steel bolt.

 

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Blue Guitar
Posted 2020-05-29 4:57 PM (#552189 - in reply to #552188)
Subject: RE: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.


Joined:
May 2020
Posts: 6

Location: Perth Australia

Blue Guitar. Hurrah, I worked out how to post photos. If you Ovation lovers want to know about how I found out how I fixed my much cherished guitar ( when even experts with 30 years fixing guitars did not know. Just ask me. It’s a interesting story.

 

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Mr. Ovation
Posted 2020-05-29 5:30 PM (#552191 - in reply to #552186)
Subject: Re: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.


Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7089

Location: The Great Pacific Northwest
Inquiring minds want to know !!!
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2020-05-29 11:01 PM (#552192 - in reply to #552186)
Subject: Re: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10535

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR
Wow! I didn't even know that came-off.




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Mr. Ovation
Posted 2020-05-30 12:37 AM (#552193 - in reply to #552186)
Subject: Re: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.


Joined:
December 2001
Posts: 7089

Location: The Great Pacific Northwest
Wow, yeah, I'm with OMA... I didn't realize that was a nut.. I thought it was part of the rod.. Good on you for spotting it and fixing it.
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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2020-05-30 12:54 AM (#552194 - in reply to #552193)
Subject: Re: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10535

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR
Mr. Ovation - 2020-05-29 10:37 PM

Wow, yeah, I'm with OMA... I didn't realize that was a nut.. I thought it was part of the rod..
Good on you for spotting it and fixing it.

Maybe nobody has ever just kept turning it counter-clockwise?
Once you loosen it a half turn, you just stop.


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Blue Guitar
Posted 2020-05-30 7:55 PM (#552197 - in reply to #552192)
Subject: Re: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.


Joined:
May 2020
Posts: 6

Location: Perth Australia

I could not find anyone to fix my guitar, I was told it was stuffed, I was told the screw thread on the truss rod was stripped and the bolt had snapped off, I was told the guitar was only good as a wall hanging, it would need a neck reset and cost at least $1000 to fix. Bla bla bla, turns out it was all bullcrap, these luthiers are supposed to be experts, after all they do it for a living. So I decided to investigate as I knew very little about truss rods how and why.

It took a while, many hours of reading, but then the penny dropped. The so called snapped off bolt was not a bolt at all, it’s a Flange, when it’s tightened it puts pressure on the truss rod, through the stiffener bar: see (24)

http://www.ovationtribute.com/Ovation_Guitars_Patents/Ovation_1977_Kaman_Bar_Patent/Ovation_1977_Kaman_Bar_Patent.html

Be patient, read and study the the patent, the Kaman bar is referred to as a Stiffener, it’s made of aluminium, the rod is made of steel. Look at (58), its called an adjustment nut. This is where the penny dropped, the so called Nut is not a nut it’s a Flange, the Flange works like this: when you tighten it ( clockwise) it pulls the truss rod straightening a warped neck, when you loosen it takes pressure off, but this Flange is not fixed, it can screw off, my guitar has no Flange, a musician friend took the flange off and threw it away and never told me, he did that because he tried to tighten the truss rod, put far to much torque, probably using an extension to get more leverage on the Allen key, so much pressure it stripped the thread on the flange, that’s WHY the flange is made of brass not steel, steel would strip the truss bar end thread. You can easily replace the flange, if the thread was stripped on the truss bar, that’s it, Guitar is ruined, now wall hanging decoration only.

So 9 times out of 10 you need to tighten the flange,

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Old Man Arthur
Posted 2020-05-30 8:05 PM (#552199 - in reply to #552186)
Subject: Re: I fixed my guitar, Perth luthiers don’t know Ovations.



Joined:
September 2006
Posts: 10535

Location: Keepin' It Weird in Portland, OR
Hello Jon.

Your membership status has been upgraded.
You may now move freely about the cabin.

Only a few people can respond in the "Welcome Center".
All others post in General Posting and other sections.

Welcome.
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